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Agenda item
APPLICATION TO VARY A PREMISES LICENCE IN RESPECT OF ASDA STORES LTD, PONTYGWINDY ROAD, CAERPHILLY
Minutes:
The Chair opened the meeting and introductions were made.
The Legal Advisor to the Sub Committee outlined
the procedure for the meeting and reported that Members had previously familiarised
themselves with the report of the Licensing Manager, the premises application
and supporting documentation, together with the written representations of
Responsible Authorities, and from local residents and local members (as defined
as Other Persons in accordance with the Licensing Act 2003) who were objecting
to the application.
Mr Lee
Morgan (Licensing Manager) presented the report and outlined the application
submitted by Asda Stores Ltd, Pontygwindy Road, Caerphilly, to vary a premises licence
in order to permit the following licensable activities:-
Supply of Alcohol
·
Monday to Sunday inclusive 00.01 to 00.00
Late Night
Refreshment
·
Monday to Sunday inclusive 23.00 to 05.00
Members were advised that the premises was seeking to extend its
existing licensed hours, (which currently end at midnight) to 24 Hours in
respect of the supply of alcohol and 05.00 for late night refreshment.
The Sub Committee were referred to the representations received in
relation to the application from Responsible Authorities. Gwent Police and Environmental Health had
made no objections to the application, and the applicant had mediated on and
agreed to the proposed conditions offered by Trading Standards and Child
Protection. During the consultation period, a representation was received from
local members and ten representations from local residents. Copies
of the representations were attached to the report that was circulated with the
agenda.
Attention was drawn to the local policy considerations and national
guidance as set out in the report and to the way in which the Sub Committee
would deal with the application. It was
explained that the Sub Committee must have regard to all the representations
made and to the evidence heard, and take such steps as is considered necessary
for the promotion of the licensing objectives.
Members were directed to the recommendation set out in the Licensing
Manager’s report, which recommended that the variation be granted subject to
agreed conditions in respect of the prevention of underage sales training and
the Challenge 25 policy. The Sub
Committee were reminded that this was purely a recommendation and that they
should take into account all the information before them when making their
decision.
All parties present
were afforded the opportunity to ask questions and representations were then
invited from Responsible Authorities.
Mr Tim Keohane (Senior Trading Standards Officer) explained that the representation
from Trading Standards was restricted to the Protection of Children from Harm
Licensing Objective. He confirmed that
the applicant had agreed to suggested additional conditions in respect of the
prevention of underage sales training and the Challenge 25 policy.
There were no questions received and representations were then invited
from Child Protection.
Mrs Deborah Lewis (Child Protection Co-ordinator) explained that the
representation from Child Protection was also related to the Protection of
Children from Harm Licensing Objective.
The applicant had also responded to them to agree suggested additional
conditions regarding the prevention of underage sales training and the Challenge 25
policy.
There were no questions received and representations were then invited
from Other Persons.
The Sub Committee noted the representation from local members (comprising
two county councillors and a community councillor) in objection to the
application to vary the premises licence.
Mr Eric Serebro (Local Resident) then addressed the Sub Committee in
respect of his representations and those made by his partner.
Mr Serebro explained that he lives on Pontygwindy Road in Caerphilly
and is subject to noise pollution from public houses in the area, a local car
wash, and speeding motorists on the road.
He acknowledged that these problems are peripheral to the premises
itself but was of the view that the premises variation would exacerbate these
problems and increase traffic congestion and pollution in the area. He also cited problems arising from instances
of joyriding and young drivers congregating in their vehicles in the Asda car
park and felt that Asda needed to increase their security presence to tackle
this issue. Overall, he held concerns
regarding the detrimental impact that the premises variation could have on the
area surrounding Pontygwindy Road.
All parties were
afforded the opportunity to ask questions and in response to a Member’s query
on the reporting of these issues, Mr Serebro explained that he had contacted
Environmental Health about noise emanating from the car wash. The situation had been monitored and the
noise level had since reduced. Mr
Serebro confirmed that he had not complained to the police about speeding
traffic but was of the view that traffic calming measures needed to be urgently
implemented in the area. He explained
that he held concerns regarding the cumulative effect arising from a variation
to the Asda licence.
The Chair
emphasised that the Sub Committee could only consider the evidence placed
before them and Mr Serebro acknowledged this but reiterated his view that Asda
should address any security issues on their land, and explained that these were
having a detrimental effect on himself and his neighbours.
A Member queried
the details of opening times for other premises in the Pontygwindy Road
area. The Licensing Manager confirmed
that he did not have exact numbers to hand but that there may be a number of
businesses in the area offering late night refreshment.
Representations were then invited
from the applicant, Asda Stores Ltd.
Mr Richard Taylor (Gosschalks
Solicitors) spoke on behalf of his client and summarised the reasons for the
premises variation application. He explained that the premises was not seeking to
open 24/7 but was merely seeking flexibility to offer alcohol sales and late
night refreshments on occasions when it does open for longer hours. The Sub Committee were advised that there is
no intention to increase late night operation of the in-store café, but rather
that Asda were seeking flexibility to sell hot food and drinks available
through their coffee machine, bakery and rotisserie outlets.
Mr Taylor explained that Asda Stores Ltd had made over a hundred premises
variation applications leading up to the Christmas period, and were seeking
maximum flexibility for their stores in view of their busiest trading day (23rd
December) falling on a Sunday in 2018.
As stores are restricted by Sunday trading hours, Asda were seeking to
open longer around this period, either on Christmas Eve or in the run up to
this date. The variation application was
therefore intended to maximise the flexibility available to its customers.
Mr Taylor
explained that there are no operational issues concerning Asda Caerphilly, and
outlined the measures that are taken to uphold the licensing objectives,
including CCTV, a full programme of staff training, and adherence to the
Challenge 25 policy, including till prompts for age restricted products and
independent test purchasing carried out by Asda. Mr Taylor stated that Asda had never faced a
premises review and that this is an indication of the stringent measures in
place to uphold the licensing objectives.
He also confirmed that his client was amenable to the conditions
proposed by the Responsible Authorities.
Mr Taylor then
took the opportunity to address some issues raised in the representations from
Other Persons, and highlighted that whilst many of these were irrelevant to the
sale of alcohol, the representations provided the opportunity to address these
issues with residents. He emphasised
Asda’s desire to be a good neighbour and offered to meet with Mr Serebro
following the meeting to discuss the concerns and examine how Asda can deal
with any issues within their remit. He
referred to concerns over 24-hour opening and hope these had been allayed. With regards to car parking and traffic
issues, he confirmed that Asda had removed all automated barriers from their
sites but that if Asda were to receive a request from the police in respect of
traffic management, this would be examined further. He explained that young drivers congregating
in the car park was a historic problem but that staff carry out patrols in the
area, and suggested that this would be a lesser problem if the store were to
open longer, due to the increased staff presence.
Mr Taylor also
referred to other issues outlined in the written representations, confirming
that a loose manhole cover creating noise was in the process of being
addressed, and stated that the exacerbation of anti-social behaviour through
the supply of alcohol from the premises was not a view shared by the
police. He explained that the issues
surrounding litter and abandoned trolleys are nothing to do with the supply of
alcohol, and that the trolleys have wheel magnets to minimise removal from the
site. In closing, he hoped that his
submissions had allayed some of the concerns from local residents and reiterated
Asda’s stance that they would not be opening 24 hours a day and 365 days of the
year.
All parties were
afforded the opportunity to ask questions and in response to a Member’s query
regarding trading flexibility, Mr Taylor explained that Asda were seeking to
sell their full product range (including alcohol) at all times that the store
is open to the public. In response to
further questions on opening hours, he explained that although the store is not
seeking to open 24/7, a successful variation would allow for this option if
required. A Member asked whether Asda’s
security team would be tasked with tackling consumption of alcohol off the
premises and in the car park and Mr Taylor referred to the premises plan as set
out in the agenda papers. He stated that
there is no evidence of drinking in the car park and that it is very difficult
to control alcohol consumption outside of Asda’s premises range.
In response to
Member’s queries, Mr Taylor provided further details of Asda’s Challenge 25
policy, the training regime for till operators in regards to alcohol sales, the
test purchasing process utilised by Asda, and the further training that is
carried out in the event of non-compliance.
He also outlined the types of licensing hours held by Asda stores across
England and Wales, and described how Asda address any licensing concerns across
their stores and the work that they carry out with local residents and other
parties to resolve such matters. Mr
Taylor added that he would take away the feedback from his client’s application
and work with Mr Serebro and local councillors to improve areas of concern.
A Member queried
whether Licensing and Trading Standards carry out checks on licensed premises
where there may be concerns in relation to the upholding of the licensing
objectives. The Licensing Manager
confirmed that each application is assessed on its own merits, and in cases
where the licensing objectives may be under threat, the Council will interact
with the business to reach a suitable outcome.
The Licensing Manager also confirmed that he was not aware of any other
businesses in the borough experiencing similar issues to those referenced by
objectors to the Asda Caerphilly application, but emphasised that safeguards
are in place to address any premises not meeting the requirements of the
Licensing Act, and that if intervention fails to work, then a review of the
premises is an option that can be pursued.
Mr Serebro sought
clarification from Asda on areas of concern, including the measure of flexible
trading, and queried if local residents would be notified via notices or
leaflet drops about revised store opening times. Mr Taylor explained that Asda do not
undertake leaflet drops but that Christmas opening hours are advertised
in-store and online. Mr Serebro
expressed concern regarding the vagueness of potential opening hours, although
reassured in respect of concerns around 365 day opening. Mr Taylor explained that extended opening
hours would be in place around Christmas and Easter periods.
Mr Serebro also
referred to the problems with littering and abandoned store trolleys in the
area and was of the view that these are not being sufficiently addressed. The Chair raised a query on Asda’s security
arrangements and Mr Taylor outlined the assessment process to determine
security requirements across its stores, and how security is delivered via a
combination of a covert and visible security presence. He also reiterated that Asda have no control
over littering, and explained that Asda have plenty of refuse bins around the
site, and employ staff to collect loose trolleys around the site.
Mr Serebro
confirmed that he was satisfied with this response and asked whether the car
park would be fully lit during extended opening hours. Mr Taylor confirmed that this would be the
case.
The Chair queried
whether Asda were intending to open for extended hours during the Black Friday
period in November. Mr Taylor explained
that Asda do not participate in Black Friday but may seek to look at extended
opening during the Easter period.
All parties were then afforded the opportunity to sum up before the
Licensing and Gambling Sub Committee retired to make its decision.
The Licensing Manager referred the Sub Committee to the representations
already made. The Responsible
Authorities and Mr Serebro confirmed that they had nothing further to add.
Mr Taylor asked the Sub Committee to determine the application on the
basis of firm evidence, and not potential concerns or issues arising from other
premises. He referred to licensing
policy and national guidance and to the lack of representations received from
Gwent Police. He emphasised that the
Responsible Authorities were satisfied with the agreed conditions and
reiterated that there was no evidence to suggest Asda Caerphilly’s sale of
alcohol was causing any of the problems referenced in the representations. He urged the Sub Committee to have regard to
the report recommendation to grant the variation and to put the matter to rest
to allow Asda to hold discussions with Mr Serebro regarding his concerns.
The Legal Advisor informed all parties
present that the Sub Committee would retire to consider the representations
made at the meeting and they would be informed in writing of the decision in
the next 5 days.
The Sub Committee retired
at 10.53 a.m. to make its decision.
Following consideration of the application and having regard to the
Licensing Officer’s report and all the representations made, the Licensing and
Gambling Sub Committee unanimously RESOLVED that the application for a
variation of the premises licence in respect of Asda Stores Ltd, Pontygwindy
Road, Caerphilly, be granted, subject to the three conditions set out in
Paragraph 1.9 of the Licensing Manager’s report and as follows:-
1) All staff who serve
alcohol to be trained in the prevention of underage sales to a level
commensurate with their duties. All such training to be updated as necessary,
for instances when legislation changes, and should include training on how to
deal with difficult customers. The training should be clearly documented and
signed and dated by both the trainer and the member of staff receiving it.
Following a test purchase failure or similar Licensing issue the documentation
of the involved colleagues shall be available for inspection by an authorised
officer of the Licensing Authority or a constable.
2) An approved proof of age
scheme shall be adopted, implemented and advertised
within the premise such as ‘Challenge 25’ whereby an accepted form of
photographic identification shall be requested before any alcohol is sold to
any person who appears to be under 25 years of age. Acceptable proof of age
shall include identification bearing the customers photograph, date of birth
and integral
holographic mark or security measure. Suitable means of identification
would include PASS approved proof of age card, photo-card driving licence,
military identification and passport.
3) Challenge 25 point of
sale material shall be displayed at the premises, notifying
customers of the operation of the Challenge 25 scheme.
In making their decision, the Sub
Committee considered all four Licensing Objectives, the Licensing Act 2003,
revised Home Office Guidance and Caerphilly Council’s Licensing Policy.
The Sub Committee acknowledged the concerns of
the residents but formed the view that based on the evidence and submissions,
there was no demonstrable link between those concerns and the proposed sale of
alcohol or late night refreshments from the premises. Given this, the Sub Committee were of the
view that the four Licensing Objectives would not be undermined by the granting
of the application.
The Sub Committee were
satisfied that the applicant was complying with the requirements of their
existing premises licence, and were reassured that based on the evidence and
submissions before them, that the standard of compliance would continue to be
applied to the varied licence. Whilst
little weight was placed on it, the Sub Committee noted the applicant’s
willingness to work with local residents to work through the issues raised in
the responses, despite these concerns being only marginally relevant to the
application under the Licensing Act 2003.
The Sub Committee also gave weight to the lack of objections from the
responsible authorities in respect of the Licensing Objectives in regards to
the application.
The decision notice advised any
person aggrieved by the decision of their right to appeal to the local
Magistrates Court within 21 days from the date of written notification of the
decision.
The Chair declared the meeting closed at 11.30 a.m.
Supporting documents: